it. it's a tough road. believe me, i know, i have a lot of friends who are actors and actresses. it's a tough road. for them personally, it means a great deal and no one should take that away from them at all. >> it's a celebratory way to celebrate what they've done. they no longer say the winner goes to, they say the oscar goes to because there are no losers in this. what are you looking forward to tonight? >> i think seth macfarlane is very funny and russell crowe singi singing qles mis," don't sing. he's horrible. >> he's not singing is it? >> he is. he's a cast and they're singing a medley of songs. >> you're looking to seth macfarlane, what he can offer? >> he's a talented guy. oscars need help.

ratings are down. to put it in perspective, in 2000 almost 50% of the people watching tv were watching the oscars. by 2012 only 34% of people watching tv were watching the oscars. it needs a little boost, like all the award shows, they've hurt the oscars. there's no more surprise. >> how would you fix it, if you could? >> first, give me one of these. that changes everything. america would tune in, who's this idiot getting an oscar? >> i didn't think you liked them. now you want your own. >> no, no, i'm not bad-mouthing the oscars or people who win it -- >> who do you think would win? >> you, of course, randi kaye, don lemon who is sweet every saturday night, my parents, my girlfriend -- >> we're out of time. cue the music. thank you. >> nice seeing you. >> i'm susan hendricks. thanks for watching today. "state of the union" with candy crowley starts right now.

and the award for best dramatic performance go to -- washington? today, if you can't beat them, scare them. >> we are required to cut $1 billion. and if more than half of our employees are at the faa, the faa, there has to be some impact. >> delayed planes and canceled flights. the world of automatic budget cuts acourting to transportation secretary ray lahood. then despite some republican calls to pull the plug on chuck hagel's nomination for defense chief and a slow walk of the nomination of john brennan as cia director, the president stands by his men. he'll probably get what he wants. weighing the odds with senator john mccain. and guns and immigration. before bills governing either become law, they first go through the judiciary committees. a conversation with patrick leahy about the art of the

doable on two of the most contentious issues of our time. plus, five days from the next fiscal cliffhanger on forced spending cuts. >> these cuts don't have to happen. congress can turn them off any time with just a little compromise. >> deal or more hyperbole, we'll ask dan malloy, haley barbour, and jackie calmes of "the new york times." i'm candy crowley and this is "state of the union yt yt. with just five days to go until automatic spending cuts kick in, the obama administration is ratcheting up spending about aircraft carriers that can't make it to the persian gulf. if you're flying anywhere in the next month or so, the transportation secretary warns you should brace for more flight delays and longer wait lines at security checkpoints. secretary lahood joins me now. thank you for being here to talk

about this. >> good morning. >> as far as we can figure out, the faa budget, we're not even talking about the transportation, is about $15 billion, give or take. they'll have to cut $16 million, about 4%. why is that enough to cause planes to be delayed for an hour and a half? there should be must be things inside the faa budget where can you get rid of 4%. >> wire going to do that. we have been spending the last several months looking at and we will really focus on this now, every contract to see what penalties we might have to cut. we'll look at everything we possibly can to get to where we need to be, which is about $600 million in cuts. we can't do it without furloughing people. >> it's a very big budget.

let me add something else. the budget committee took a look at some of these numbers and they found post sequester, your postsequester total at ops and equipment is going to be about $500 million more than 2008 and the planes were running just fine. so, what's -- i'm trying to figure out, as you know, people saying the administration is exaggerating this. so, if you're going to be having totals, inflation adjusted at 208 -- 2008 levels, why all of this, the planes are going to be late? >> first of all, we're required to cut $1 billion. the largest number of employees at d.o.t. is at faa, of which the largest number are faa controllers. we're going to try to cut as much as we possibly can out of contracts and other things that we do.

but in the end there has to be some kind of furlough of air traffic controllers. and that, then, will also begin to curtail or eliminate the opportunity for them to guide planes in and out of airports. it's a big part of our budget. >> is it true domestic flights are down 27% from pre-9/11 levels and the budget at the faa is up 41%? >> well, look. we know that airlines have consolidated. we've approved some of those consolidations. and in doing that, you know, a certain -- >> there's less traffic. >> there's less traffic, of course. >> but more budget. >> well, listen, budgets go up and down. the bottom line here is that there's -- sequester is required. it's required by law. it means we have to make these cuts. these are not things we decided to make up. >> no, i understand. i guess what i'm trying to get

at, people think, surely there has to be money you can take and you say you're going to look at it, without having to have delayed flights. the idea was this was ginned up by the administration, not just you, but aircraft carriers can't go here and there to try to put pressure on congress. and i want to -- speaking of pressure on congress, you were quite vocal about who you blamed for this when you did your news conference. i want to play just a little bit of that. >> this requires republicans stepping forward with some ideas about how to keep essential services of government running at the level people have been accustomed to. this is not rocket science. this is people coming together the on way other congresses have done to solve big issues. >> you're a republican. you spent a lot of time on capitol hill before your current job. i understand that you work for the president now and he's a democrat. it is all the republicans' fault?

>> well, look, this sequester is very serious business and it requires us to make the reductions that we're making. it requires us as painful as it is to furlough the people that we're going to have to furlough. and we're taking it very seriously. we hope this week republicans and democrats will step forward. the president put forth a plan to find the $85 billion. $85 billion is a lot of money, candy. there has to be shared sacrifice here. we're doing our part. part of what we're doing is saying to people -- >> do you think, though, that republicans are solely to blame for this? it just seemed is that way when you gave your news conference. >> well, look, i'm a republican. my audience is trying to persuade my former colleagues they need to come to the table with a proposal, which, frankly, they haven't done. the president has. the republicans haven't. i also said at that news

conference everybody around here o ought to take a look at the "lincoln" movie where they did hard things by talking and compromising. that's what's needed here. >> ray lahood, thank you for your time and for your service. i know you're retiring. thank you for your time on capitol hill and also transportation secretary. >> thank you. when we return, republicans are demanding more answers from cia nominee brennan and replacement for hagel as defense secretary. might the president's former rival get those through nomination? john mccain is up next. ap! ] [ male announcer ] your favorite foods fighting you? fight back fast with tums. calcium-rich tums starts working so fast you'll forget you had heartburn. ♪ tum tum tum tum tums can your moisturizer do that? [ female announcer ] dermatologist recommended aveeno has an oat formula, now proven to build a moisture reserve,

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joining me is senator john mccain of arizona. i want to talk to you about these sequester, automatic budget cuts. you heard transportation secretary ray lahood talking about them. here is my question for you. everyone thinks this is -- bad things are going to happen when these forced cuts go into effect. you know, the military says that the training is going to suffer, that they're not going to be able to geships to the persian gu

gulf, we can't inspect meat, the plane are going to slow down. if it is this dire and everyone agrees it is this dire, what happens? congress goes on recess and the president goes golfing. why isn't somebody in a room somewhere, in a shirt they've had on for three days, ordering takeout pizza with a bunch of people trying to figure it out if it's that bad? >> that's exactly what we should be doing. i won't put all the blame on the president of the united states. put the president leaves. the president should be calling us over, camp david, white house, somewhere, and sitting down, trying to avert these cuts. let me say a word about the cuts quickly. we have already cut $87 billion out of defense under secretary gates. now you lay on top of that these enormous reductions as well. by the way, defense is 19% of

the overall discretionary budget. defense has taken 50% of the cuts. if we don't believe our military leaders, then who in the world do we believe? i think that what we are doing now to the men and women serving is unconscionable. these federal employees who don't know whether they'll be laid off or not, not to mention these contracts. >> doesn't that make my point? shouldn't someone somewhere -- >> i stand -- senator levin, senator graham, senator reid and i tried a greer ago. a year ago. we went around the country to these various places, including norfolk, virginia, where the president, i understand, is going this coming week, warning of the effects of these cuts. and i say to my republican friends, if you want to just give the president flexibility as to how to enact these cuts in defense spending, then why don't we go home and just give him the

money? i'm totally opposed to that. we spent too long on defense authorization and finding out what this country needs to secure this country without saying, hey, well, we'll just let the president have the, quote, flexibility. that's not the answer. the answer is to prevent these reductions. we are already cutting defense. i can find lots of waste in mismanagement but, by god, across the board cuts are the worst and most cowardly way to approach this situation. >> yet we're headed there. >> yes, we are. >> again, it's so frustrating because you think somebody ought to pick this up and do something about it. >> again, republican leaders should be saying to the president, along with democratic leaders, let's sit down and work this out. that's the way we is avoided crisis in the past. >> what do you think of secretary lahood, a republican, blaming republicans for this? >> shame on ray lahood. no, listen, i understand. there's a bob woodward piece in

"the post" this morning about who the idea for sequestration was, and we know who now it was. came from the white house and the president's aides. despite that, the president said -- >> congress went for it. >> the president said during his campaign, won't happen. i said during the campaign, and so did others, we have to stop this from happening. the president has now said it's congress' fault. we know the president wasn't telling the truth from that. >> 15 of your colleagues, i want to switch to chuck hagel, nominated to be defense secretary. 15 of your colleagues, including jim inhofe, sent a letter to the president saying, withdrawal his name. why did you not sign that letter? >> because i don't believe chuck hagel, who is a friend of mine, is qualified to be secretary of defense. but i do believe elections have consequences, unfortunately, and the president of the united states was re-elected. i believe when questions are

answered, and i believe they will be this week and the president deserves an up or down vote. democrats will say, we've never done that before. they have with bolton and others. that doesn't mean we shouldn't give chuck hagel an up or down vote. and i think we should. >> as far as you know, is there anything standing between chuck hagel and that vote? a hold? anybody willing to do that? you think this will happen? >> i think it will happen, barring some additional revelation concerning his comments about israel and all those other really unfortunate things he said in the past. >> let me ask you about john brennan, nominated to be cia director. you wanted certain information about benghazi. how far are you willing to go to delay the brennan vote in order to get the information you want? >> i think it depends on his answers, to start with. second of all, we still don't know who was rescued from the consulate in benghazi. we still don't know who made out

the trackialking points. mr. brennan said he was opposed to waterboarding and torture but at the same time he has said it has saved lives. i would like to know what lives were saved because the information i have is it saved no one's life. in fact, it was a lot of misinformation. >> if you don't get answers, would you put a hold on that? would you try -- >> i think you examine your options when you decide on -- when you -- on the information, but he needs to answer these questions. and they say why now? it's the only time we have maximum leverage. that's just a fact of life around washington. look, i don't want to put a hold on anybody but the american people deserve answers about benghazi. there are so many questions still out there, including what was the president doing the night benghazi happened? >> let me turn you finally to a domestic issue here. that is immigration. you had quite the town hall meeting or series of them out in arizona. i want to show our listeners a little bit of what happened.

>> they're going to be on medicare. they're employigoing to be on w food stamps. >> again -- >> you know it. what's going to happen -- >> again, sir, you're not telling us the truth. >> why bring a 30 million people into the united states, cut off their welfare and all their stuff and they'll go back. >> so, lots of echoes here of previous elections. >> yeah, but you know, people -- some people say, oh, look at that. that's what town halls are supposed to be about. that's why they're always packed, as you notice. i've had town hall meetings for 30 years and sometimes they become very spirited. i enjoy them. we don't screen anybody who comes to our taown hall meeting and it gives the people a chance. i didn't believe that person was correct with his facts so i fired back at him. people said, good, that's what we want to hear. it's a debate. i'm proud of that. if anybody doesn't like it, you don't have to come to the town

hall meeting. >> what does it tell you about the base of the republican party? does it tell you you have a problem in selling immigration reform? >> actually the majority of americans and i believe majority of republicans, as long as they -- one, that the borders is effectively controlled and, two, that the people who are here illegally get in the line behind everyone else who came here legally because they broke the law. but just because they broke the law doesn't mean they're condemned forever. for these people who have come illegally, pay back taxes, pay a fine, learn english and get behind everybody else, that's a key element of it. and most americans now realize we can't have 11 million people sit in the twilight -- in the shadows -- >> most americans don't vote in republican primaries. what do you think the effect is going to be? >> i think it's going to be okay as long as we have effective

control over our border and we don't make the mistake of 1986. we gave amnesty to 3 million people and we ended up with 11 million here. we can't have a third wave. >> senator, thanks. a u.s. delegation went to cuba to meet with president castro about securing am imprisoned american but they came home empty handed. >> senator patrick leahy joins us next. >> i think everybody realizes this is not the 19d6 0z. different century. different world. hh, probably google. if we do a side by side blind test comparison, and you end up choosing google, you get an xbox. i'll bet you the xbox, you bet me your son. well let's look up what you need. okay, i would do the left. yeah? what?! i am a daddy! bing wins it! bing won. bing did win. people prefer bing over google for the web's top searches.

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it's been almost two decades since congress passed major gun control legislation. almost three since immigration reform as we explain it in washington, the politics are difficult. the overwhelming democratic hispanic vote in november election and the mass murders inside a connecticut elementary school transformed two of the most volatile issues on the congressional dockett into the two most likely to see action. public opinion favors reform on

both and that concentrates the mind of politicians, not to mention give them some cover. still politics remain difficult. >> you don't need an ar-15. it's harder to aim. it's harder to use. and, in fact, you don't need 30 rounds to protect yourself. buy a shotgun. >> see, it's not about making our kids or our streets safer. it's about their decades' old agenda. the elites in washington are not serious. >> as for the politics of immigration, consider the ruckus. >> i know that senator rubio was upset with this leak. >> leaking this out does set things in the wrong direction. >> in reality the specifics are a lot more difficult than the general notion of reform. under what conditions should

undocumented workers be allowed to pursue legal status. should legalization be tied to border security? should gun magazines be limited to what, ten rounds? seven rounds? and what exemptions should there be to universal background checks? just because most lawmakers want to do something doesn't mean they want to do everything. you know what is in the details. eventually immigration and gun control reform, details and all, will run through the judiciary committee. its chairman, senator patrick leahy is here next with his take on what's doable in 2013. [ woman ] ring. ring. progresso.

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this is not universal background checks. this is universal registration of all of your firearms and all of people like you all over america. >> that was wayne lapierre, executive vice president of nra. joining me is patrick leahy of vermont. is that true? you know that's what some gun owners fear, is that a background check is nothing more than a way to get registration. >> no, it's not going to be registration. of course, the speaker knows that, but he's paid very well to stir up his membership and help increakreecrease dues-paying me. i think we need to stop the rhetoric. i'm a gun owner. a lot of people in my state of

vermont are gun owners. i know the last time i went in to purchase a firearm, hi to go through a background check. i didn't have any problem with doing that. >> and what do they do with that information? when you go in and say, this is my name, address, phone number. no, don't have any mental health problems. they put it in a background check and what happens with that? >> they check to see if you told the truth and then it's cleared out. >> it gets deleted, is what you're saying. >> yes. but what happens, i don't mind having a background check for me, but i don't someone with two felonies for armed robbery to come in and have a background check. unless you have a universal background check, it doesn't apply to someone who may have had a felony. the fact is most gun owners i talk to in vermont say, the rules -- as long as it applies to everyone. don't make exceptions. unfortunately, the speaker was talking about making exceptions. i don't think there should be

exemptions at a gun show, for straw purchasers. we want to say everybody. so, if you have a violent crime in your background, if you're under a restraining order, if you have some of these problems, you're not going to be able to legally purchase a firearm. >> at gun shows, is what we're talking about here. >> at gun shows or -- >> expanding background checks to gun shows or private sales. >> your local gun store has to pay taxes to the community, to the state, fill out all these rules. why should they have stiffer rules than someone that sets up in the fairground for a week. >> we want to clarify, when you say the speaker in your previous remarks, you're talking about wayne lapierre, not speaker boehner. >> no, no, not speaker boehner. >> what you're saying is all of that information, if you were a law-abiding citizen with no records, no mental health

problems, whatever information you have given to that gun store or whoever that is then fed into for a background check, goes away. they press delete. so no one knows you own that. >> it's not a registration. you don't find out -- but if you've -- but if you've lied about it, then that is going to be retained. >> let me ask you, because there are so many issues coming to your committee. i wanted to ask you about immigration. you made an opening statement during one of your hearings that just said, you know, that you basically oppose the idea of tying border security to allowing undocumented workers to begin a pathway towards legalization. and yet what we're led to believe is bipartisan committee wants to do exactly that. >> no. what i'm saying is don't make the perfect -- the enemy of the good. if you say there must be total

security before we can go forward, that's never going to happen. we spend billions and billions of dollars -- >> but measurements along the way. >> i don't mind measurements. i think this administration, the obama administration, has spent more money on border security than any administration in history. there is still going to be some people getting through. i don't want it to be a case where you say, until not one person can get through immigration reform. that's never going to happen. we're content -- improve border security, of course. but at the same time, find some way to have immigration reform. the time is now. it's unrealistic to expect that some day you're going to have 11 million people but we'll just throw you out of the country, you couldn't do it. they're not going to do it. let's see if they come in the same way my maternal grandparents came in or my wife's grandparents came in.

let's make sure we have a way they become citizens. >> i want to ask you about your recent trip to cuba but a wrap-up question on guns and immigration. at the end of the year will you be able to say the first year of this congress passed both immigration reform and gun control reform in some manner? >> i think we will. if people want to come together. i'm working with republicans and democrats, unless we work with both republicans and democrats, we'll pass nothing. >> you were recently in cuba. you met with alan gross, an american prisoner in cuba, a contract worker. he's been detained since 2009. you also met with raul castro, the new president. did you speak to him about the fate of mr. gross and what did you find out about, a, mr. gross' health and, b, whether there's any room in there to get him out? >> well, i have spoken twice to president raul castro about mr. gross. both my wife and i have met with

him twice. i met with mr. gross twice. i did this past week. i said i would have loved to have put him on my airplane and brought him back out with me. that's not going to happen. he's not going to be released by the cubans because of pressure from the united states. that does not work. it hasn't worked in the past. i think there are ways that he can be released but it's going to require some give and take on both sides and some quiet negotiation. i think the worst thing that can happen is if we say either in our country or their country in this 1960s, the 1970s cold war mentality, we're a different century now. we should be looking at what's the future for their future and ours, what's the future for their children and our children and i think if we do that, i think we can find things not only to settle the alan gross

issue, but a whole lot of other issues. >> so you're suggesting perhaps that you could say, listen, what about if we ease the embargo further or got rid of the embargo, if you'll let him go, i will work, that kind of thing? >> i'm not going to go into specific things, but we have a number of issues we should be looking at. we have them on a terrorist list. it makes no sense. they've been working with the colombians on the issue of the farc. they've been very effective. they've worked with us on drug interdiction. there's one thing we can do. there's lots of things we can do. the embargo is one. the fact you and i have to get permission to go to cuba from our own government, you know, if makes no sense. >> that's a relic of the past. >> yeah. >> listen, have you a lot on your plate, senator. i wish you luck -- >> it will be an interesting year. >> it will. up next, if the forced spending cuts go through, whose fault is it? that's easy. the other guy's.

>> it appears that republicans in congress have decided that instead of compromising, they'd rather let these cuts fall squarely on the middle class. >> why won't he work with us? and the answer, quite simply, is because he wants higher taxes. [ female announcer ] imagine skin so healthy, it never gets dry again. can your moisturizer do that? [ female announcer ] dermatologist recommended aveeno has an oat formula, now proven to build a moisture reserve, so skin can replenish itself. that's healthy skin for life. only from aveeno.

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then you're going to love this. right now they're only $14.95! wow-a grt deal just got a whole lot better. hurry. $14.95 won't last. here with me around the table, gwen eiffel of pbs, haley barbour and jackie calmes of "the new york times." so when we went into the break, we heard the president say, the republicans just aren't working with me on the sequestration, the automatic budget cuts. and then we had the republicans saying, why won't the president work with us on this? in the end, who gets blamed for this.

>> well -- >> and this, by the way, is, oh, we can't do meat inspection and we can't fly planes and we can't send ships to the gulf. >> right. well, i think there's a lot of attacks on both your houses but the republicans come into this with the polls in the past and these showdowns which have become so routine, that they've come out the losers in this. and they know it. and, you know, they're at a disadvantage. any time the party's power in the congressional wing is in a relative disadvantage to the president to whichever party the president is from. but the republicans have a record here. the polls have shown in the past they've been blamed more than the president. and that's likely to happen here, too. i mean, if not -- just for the fact that last week they were on vacation all week, democrats and republicans in congress. >> so, a bad idea to force the sequestration, the budget cuts? >> well, it was a bad idea, it was the president's idea. the president brought up this idea. the republicans, the democrats

couldn't agree on budget deficit reduction, went along with it. since then the republican house has twice, twice passed alternatives to the sequestration. democrats have never taken it up. the president has never dealt with it. so, who gets the blame? well, if the story tells that the republican house has twice passed alternatives that would mean there would be no sequestration, well, i think that the public would say, well, why didn't the president do something? why did they take a vacation when the republicans have already passed two solutions? >> well, the republicans actually passed it the last congress and they would have to do it again this congress. but you're right, they did day it up -- >> and they would have gutted the middle class in that proposal. that's what that did. we have to tell the whole story here. they want to make sure they get their defense spending, so they want to take more out of services. they want to take more out of the middle class. they want to really beat up the middle class pretty bad. that's unacceptable. come to the table, everybody.

everybody come to the table. work this thing out. >> i mean, do you agree, you know, the president went golfing, you know, he has perfect right to go golfing. congress takes a break. they take breaks all the time. and yet we're told that life as we know it is going to change and they're off not paying attention. >> which is why the polls that jackie was talking about show that people are so ultimately frustrated by this. the finger pointing does no one any good. whoever put it on the table first, whose idea it was, matters not. if, indeed, air traffic controllers aren't going to be showing up to work f they're going to be furloughed. i do think we've spent this week with the president in the white house saying, the sky is falling. but if you're at home and you don't even know what the word sequestration means, all it means is washington isn't working again, no matter whose fault it is. >> but we're going to furlough 576 national guardsmen in connecticut. that's what we're going to do. this has real consequences. and it's absolutely the wrong time to be doing this. it is estimated by the

congressional budget office that this will cost 750,000 jobs at absolutely the wrong time. we have states that are finally adding jobs. what does congress want to do? they want to cut 750,000 jobs. >> look, beauty is in the eye of the beholder. republicans put up two alternatives to this. if governor malloy doesn't like them, why doesn't democrats put up an alternative? >> they say they have. this is the problem -- >> when did the senate pass this? i don't remember them bringing it up. i don't remember that. >> they didn't. go ahead. >> the whole thing of whose to blame for sequester is one of the oddest arguments i've ever covered in washington in like 30 years. it's both sides. they have the particulars of this idea came from the white house. but it was -- they took an idea that, i'm sorry to say, i covered in the mid-'80s for congressional quarterly magazine, the graham/rudman sequestration and two republican senators came up with what they said was a bad idea whose time

has come. both parties in this case wanted something so odeus that it would force them to the negotiating table. that hasn't happened. >> the one thing more odeus than this is the negotiating table. while i have you here i want to ask you about immigration. this is a cause you have taken up. i want to read you something charlie cook, a well-known political analyst out of national journal said about the president. if the president really cares about enacting immigration reform, he will get off the campaign trail, depoliticize it. >> he made a good statement. there is bipartisan support. there's a lot of complicated stuff. i was political director of the white house when we did this more than 25 years ago. the last time. it took two full years, candy. i think this is going to happen in spring. that's not realistic. this is very complex. for many people, contentious, but i think it will happen in

this congress, but it has to be bipartisan to be successful. >> we saw this week a little with john mccain's town hall meetings and just that -- that this is becoming, and i'm going to talk about gun control a little later, the same way i see the gun control legislation, is that the edge and fervor to let's pass it, let's pass it, has now given way to reality. >> the difference is, and we can talk about this, what the white house is pushing is the gun control legislation, gun violence policy, i think is the term they're using now. but when it comes to imgreg, the big sticking point is not all the bad feelings about whether we should do it or not, the sticking point is border security. a very good point, turns out border security is actually stronger than it's been in places like el paso and san diego. so, we're having that fight about this sticking point when all the bigger, longer term, who gets to the end of the line fights are really the ones which are going to cause the emotion. >> let me just ask you, to gwen's point, when you were at the white house with the president, did he bring up immigration reform? >> we discussed immigration.

we spent a fair amount of time on immigration. the idea that the president shouldn't speak to this issue is utterly ridiculous. of course he should speak to this. he should lead the discussion. that's the role of the president of the united states. and for one party to recommend that he not speak about one of the most important issues facing the nation is ridiculous. >> actually, it was charlie kooshgs a political analyst. i take your point. >> i heard your endorsement of it. i just heard it. >> we should not let this be partisan. look, when the president leads like ronald reagan or bill clinton, he leads for bipartisanship. >> when we come back, if you want a gun, the vice president has some advice on what kind to buy. >> you should be able to go buy a flame-thrower, buy an f-15, an m-1 tank, buy a machine gun, buy a grenade launcher. and you can't do those things. buy a shotgun. so trusted... so clinically proven dermatologists recommend it twice as much

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we are back with gwen iffill governor dan malloy and governor jackie calmes. joe biden over the past week or so told folks they should buy shotguns much better than semi

assault weapons. i want to show you what the nra has done to that in an online ad. >> so, joe, if there is ever a problem, just walk out on the balcony here and walk out, put that double barrel shotgun and fire two blasts outside the house. >> more than 300,000 women face aggravated assaults every year and joe biden's answer -- >> fire two blasts outside the house. >> great advice, joe. not only would that be illegal, but a woman would face an attacker with an empty shotgun. >> is the vice president helping your cause when these sorts of things get turned into ads like this? >> more women will be killed by guns that their husbands have in their house this year than last year. that's what's going on here. women are the victim of this crime. women are shot and killed by their husbands and lovers. let's not play games that the nra wants us to play. >> sure. well, go ahead, i'll just let

you take this one. >> i don't know why the nra got vice president biden to say that. >> he's advocating shotguns. shotguns are perfectly legal and they hunt and he's a gun guy. ar-15 things that we keep. it's just so right for them to take out. >> listen, you had a piece on by the vice president of the nra. listen, he's a gold mine, that guy. there's a disconnect here. newtown has changed this country. it's a different debate. it's a different discussion. and i understand that some states will go and do their own thing and perhaps we'll get something out of the congress of the united states. but why should anyone be able to buy a gun without a permit? why? you can't get on a plane without somebody doing a background check. why should you buy a gun and not have that done? >> joe biden had a couple points, but one was that he, that he's trying to imply or

show that democrats are aren't anti-gun. so, it's like but, you know, the nra made for a good commercial. but the fact of the matter is he's showing he's not anti-gun. >> democrats are are not trying to get rid of people's guns. >> what's more important here, governor malloy's state has, i think i heard you say one of the five toughest gun control laws in the united states. everything this man did who m d murdered these children in a awful, horrific, unbelievable gruesome thing was already illegal. that's why guys like me say if you make having guns illegal, only criminals will have guns. now, this guy, everything he did was already against the law. it's been against the law, would have stopped it. >> can't we say there's actual movement happening on capitol hill. four senators, bipartisan senators, are reaching an agreement on the idea of universal background checks. there will be exceptions and

limitations. >> governor malloy, i wanted to ask you about that because you put out your own state proposal for what you would like to do in terms of cracking down on gun sales and the illegal purchase of guns, et cetera. there was criticism at the time last week that you did it before a commission came out and said, here's what i recommend. do you sense that time is running out? that you're losing that window of opportunity post-newtown. >> listen, it's 72 days later. the people of newtown, the children who were murdered, the adults were murdered deserve an answer. haley's wrong about what he said. you can buy an a-15 in our state. i look forward to the day you can't do that. you can have 30-round magazines when prior to 2004, they were illegal. i look forward to connecticut doing away with 30-round magazines. i believe we need universal background checks. you should not be able to buy a gun at a gun show or private sale without a